Here are a few scribbles some of you may enjoy, based on my experiences as an INTP working with SFJs.
An INTP's Guide to Dealing with Others
(written with SFJs in mind.)
1. Do not argue.
2. Listen quietly. Say "Thank you, I really appreciate [what you just did]", and they will be happy to continue [doing it] indefinitely.
3. Ss are not interested in theories. They just aren't. It's a stress for them to hear how you cleverly figured something out. They don't want to know their psychological type and what it means. They want to know what's happening and what to do.
4. SFJs need to give to other people and feel useful the same way INTPs need to speculate. This is sometimes hard for INTPs to understand. It makes an SFJ feel happy and validated when you say "Thank you, I really appreciate it.", even for the tenth time. They enjoy being, and need to be, appreciated for fulfilling their duties, just as INTPs enjoy and need a certain amount of intellectual conversation.
5. Ss love following rules as much as INTPs love understanding and designing them. It's as difficult to get an SFJ to disobey rules, as they feel the same anxiety breaking them as an INTP being forced to follow tedious, illogical rules. Try not to suggest breaking the rules to an SFJ to often or they will not trust you.
6. Come early, not late. SFJs will forgive many things but they my be very irritated by irresponsibility.
7. Find out what you should be feeling, which SFJs make very easy, (they use operant conditioning to enforce rules), and express it the way you're supposed to. Even if you don't see the point, SFJs are easier to convince when you need their trust and support to break or change a rule when they feel you are reliable.
8. Expect to spend a lot of time repeating conversatinos. SFJs love, love, love shmoozing, especially on the telephone, and they don't care if what they really mean by "love" is "very much enjoy." If this is hard for you, realize it's the same conversation as yesterday and think about something else while going through the motions. SFJs won't spring surprises or intellectual challenges on you.
9. Other people and things interest them. If you run out of things to talk about, ask them a nice practical question, like "Did you get your watch at the same place I did?" Do not ask them any interesting questions to liven up the conversation for yourself like "Which magazines do you read?", which will lead to your making an intellectual and therefore, for the SFJ, tiresome comment.
10. SFJs take time to settle their thoughts in intellectual matters. If you do manage to get into an interesting discussion with an SFJ, expect them to take a long time to formulate their thoughts. They usually need time to think about how to express their position and will often ask to continue the conversation tomorrow.
11. SFJs feel obligated to do whatever they can for those for whom they care, even if they aren't sure if it will help or not. Try to guide them to effective interventions and if you do so properly, they can do tremendous things.
I have no idea where to put this and Creative Expression seems best. Rip it apart, comment, pretend you never read it, whatever.
Full Version: For I N Tps
QUOTE(existwhere? @ Aug 31 2007, 08:24 AM) 
Here are a few scribbles some of you may enjoy, based on my experiences as an INTP working with SFJs.
An INTP's Guide to Dealing with Others
(written with SFJs in mind.)
1. Do not argue.
2. Listen quietly. Say "Thank you, I really appreciate [what you just did]", and they will be happy to continue [doing it] indefinitely.
3. Ss are not interested in theories. They just aren't. It's a stress for them to hear how you cleverly figured something out. They don't want to know their psychological type and what it means. They want to know what's happening and what to do.
4. SFJs need to give to other people and feel useful the same way INTPs need to speculate. This is sometimes hard for INTPs to understand. It makes an SFJ feel happy and validated when you say "Thank you, I really appreciate it.", even for the tenth time. They enjoy being, and need to be, appreciated for fulfilling their duties, just as INTPs enjoy and need a certain amount of intellectual conversation.
5. Ss love following rules as much as INTPs love understanding and designing them. It's as difficult to get an SFJ to disobey rules, as they feel the same anxiety breaking them as an INTP being forced to follow tedious, illogical rules. Try not to suggest breaking the rules to an SFJ to often or they will not trust you.
6. Come early, not late. SFJs will forgive many things but they my be very irritated by irresponsibility.
7. Find out what you should be feeling, which SFJs make very easy, (they use operant conditioning to enforce rules), and express it the way you're supposed to. Even if you don't see the point, SFJs are easier to convince when you need their trust and support to break or change a rule when they feel you are reliable.
8. Expect to spend a lot of time repeating conversatinos. SFJs love, love, love shmoozing, especially on the telephone, and they don't care if what they really mean by "love" is "very much enjoy." If this is hard for you, realize it's the same conversation as yesterday and think about something else while going through the motions. SFJs won't spring surprises or intellectual challenges on you.
9. Other people and things interest them. If you run out of things to talk about, ask them a nice practical question, like "Did you get your watch at the same place I did?" Do not ask them any interesting questions to liven up the conversation for yourself like "Which magazines do you read?", which will lead to your making an intellectual and therefore, for the SFJ, tiresome comment.
10. SFJs take time to settle their thoughts in intellectual matters. If you do manage to get into an interesting discussion with an SFJ, expect them to take a long time to formulate their thoughts. They usually need time to think about how to express their position and will often ask to continue the conversation tomorrow.
11. SFJs feel obligated to do whatever they can for those for whom they care, even if they aren't sure if it will help or not. Try to guide them to effective interventions and if you do so properly, they can do tremendous things.
I have no idea where to put this and Creative Expression seems best. Rip it apart, comment, pretend you never read it, whatever.
An INTP's Guide to Dealing with Others
(written with SFJs in mind.)
1. Do not argue.
2. Listen quietly. Say "Thank you, I really appreciate [what you just did]", and they will be happy to continue [doing it] indefinitely.
3. Ss are not interested in theories. They just aren't. It's a stress for them to hear how you cleverly figured something out. They don't want to know their psychological type and what it means. They want to know what's happening and what to do.
4. SFJs need to give to other people and feel useful the same way INTPs need to speculate. This is sometimes hard for INTPs to understand. It makes an SFJ feel happy and validated when you say "Thank you, I really appreciate it.", even for the tenth time. They enjoy being, and need to be, appreciated for fulfilling their duties, just as INTPs enjoy and need a certain amount of intellectual conversation.
5. Ss love following rules as much as INTPs love understanding and designing them. It's as difficult to get an SFJ to disobey rules, as they feel the same anxiety breaking them as an INTP being forced to follow tedious, illogical rules. Try not to suggest breaking the rules to an SFJ to often or they will not trust you.
6. Come early, not late. SFJs will forgive many things but they my be very irritated by irresponsibility.
7. Find out what you should be feeling, which SFJs make very easy, (they use operant conditioning to enforce rules), and express it the way you're supposed to. Even if you don't see the point, SFJs are easier to convince when you need their trust and support to break or change a rule when they feel you are reliable.
8. Expect to spend a lot of time repeating conversatinos. SFJs love, love, love shmoozing, especially on the telephone, and they don't care if what they really mean by "love" is "very much enjoy." If this is hard for you, realize it's the same conversation as yesterday and think about something else while going through the motions. SFJs won't spring surprises or intellectual challenges on you.
9. Other people and things interest them. If you run out of things to talk about, ask them a nice practical question, like "Did you get your watch at the same place I did?" Do not ask them any interesting questions to liven up the conversation for yourself like "Which magazines do you read?", which will lead to your making an intellectual and therefore, for the SFJ, tiresome comment.
10. SFJs take time to settle their thoughts in intellectual matters. If you do manage to get into an interesting discussion with an SFJ, expect them to take a long time to formulate their thoughts. They usually need time to think about how to express their position and will often ask to continue the conversation tomorrow.
11. SFJs feel obligated to do whatever they can for those for whom they care, even if they aren't sure if it will help or not. Try to guide them to effective interventions and if you do so properly, they can do tremendous things.
I have no idea where to put this and Creative Expression seems best. Rip it apart, comment, pretend you never read it, whatever.
I only tried reading this thread because I have no idea what the heck you are talking about.
QUOTE(glockenspiel @ Aug 31 2007, 09:11 AM)
I only tried reading this thread because I have no idea what the heck you are talking about.
I'm sorry.
Thread One on h.com
Thread Two on h.com
What this is talking about:
QUOTE
The developed theory today is that every individual has a primary mode of operation within four categories:
Our Flow of Energy defines how we receive the essential part of our stimulation. Do we receive it from within ourselves (Introverted) or from external sources (Extraverted)? Is our dominant function focused externally or internally?
The topic of how we Take in Information deals with our preferred method of taking in and absorbing information. Do we trust our five senses (Sensing) to take in information, or do we rely on our instincts (iNtuitive)?
The third type of preference, how we prefer to Make Decisions, refers to whether we are prone to decide things based on logic and objective consideration (Thinking), or based on our personal, subjective value systems (Feeling). These first three preferences were the basis of Jung's theory of Personalty Types. Isabel Briggs Myers developed the theory of the fourth preference, which is concerned with how we deal with the external world on a Day-to-day Basis. Are we organized and purposeful, and more comfortable with scheduled, structured environments (Judging), or are we flexible and diverse, and more comfortable with open, casual environments (Perceiving)? From a theoretical perspective, we know that if our highest Extraverted function is a Decision Making function, we prefer Judging. If our highest Extraverted function is an Information Gathering function, we prefer Perceiving.
...
The theory of Personality Types, as it stand today, contends that:
An individual is either primarily Extraverted or Introverted
An individual is either primarily Sensing or iNtuitive
An individual is either primarily Thinking or Feeling An individual is either primarily Judging or Perceiving
from here- our flow of energy
- how we take in information
- how we prefer to make decisions
- the basic day-to-day lifestyle that we prefer
- Extraverted or Introverted
- Sensing or iNtuitive
- Thinking or Feeling
- Judging or Perceiving
Our Flow of Energy defines how we receive the essential part of our stimulation. Do we receive it from within ourselves (Introverted) or from external sources (Extraverted)? Is our dominant function focused externally or internally?
The topic of how we Take in Information deals with our preferred method of taking in and absorbing information. Do we trust our five senses (Sensing) to take in information, or do we rely on our instincts (iNtuitive)?
The third type of preference, how we prefer to Make Decisions, refers to whether we are prone to decide things based on logic and objective consideration (Thinking), or based on our personal, subjective value systems (Feeling). These first three preferences were the basis of Jung's theory of Personalty Types. Isabel Briggs Myers developed the theory of the fourth preference, which is concerned with how we deal with the external world on a Day-to-day Basis. Are we organized and purposeful, and more comfortable with scheduled, structured environments (Judging), or are we flexible and diverse, and more comfortable with open, casual environments (Perceiving)? From a theoretical perspective, we know that if our highest Extraverted function is a Decision Making function, we prefer Judging. If our highest Extraverted function is an Information Gathering function, we prefer Perceiving.
...
The theory of Personality Types, as it stand today, contends that:
An individual is either primarily Extraverted or Introverted
An individual is either primarily Sensing or iNtuitive
An individual is either primarily Thinking or Feeling An individual is either primarily Judging or Perceiving
'SFJ' means a Sensing Feeling Judging personality, and 'INTP' means an Introverted Intuitive Thinking Perceiving personality.
Eh. Too condescending. Too simplistic. Little mindless drones happily doing what they're told because the wise INTP told them so. Yup. Makes for a greeeeeeat relationship.
QUOTE(ClopCup @ Aug 31 2007, 09:28 AM)
Eh. Too condescending. Too simplistic. Little mindless drones happily doing what they're told because the wise INTP told them so. Yup. Makes for a greeeeeeat relationship.
I think SFJ is a wonderful personality type which enables people to give a lot to the world. I am very close to one person who has this personality type and is undoubtedly smarter than me, who has given me advice on numerous occasions. This personality isn't mindless, they just aren't intellectually critical as INTps are. That they do not enjoy and even chafe at theoretical work doesn't mean they're dumb; they prefer a different sort of thinking.
How would you correct it?
By the way, I read this to that SFJ, who thought it was very funny.
I more or less agree with this. Won't keep me from feeling frustrated with SFJ's, though.
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