"And He will judge between the nations, And will render decisions for many peoples; And they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, And never again will they learn war."

This passuk is saying that there since there would be no more use for weapons, mankind will turn his weapons into something useful. Obviously its not that difficult to understand the concept of a sword being beaten into a plowshare. They are both metal and basically the same shape. What about modern weapons like guns, fighter planes, nuclear warheads etc? What uses can we possible get out of them in ymos mashiach?

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Are you kidding? The technologies used to develop military weaponry are used in every technologies from cellular phones to digital satellite television to gps.

So what are missiles turned into?

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You are missing the point.

Whats the point?

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The technology used for war will be used for peace only.

The technology used to develop missiles will be used for peaceful purposes such as energy production and agriculture.

In Russia they have a place where you can fly in a Mig-29 which is beyond awesome...

wow. cool!

What about existing missiles? The passuk doesnt say weapons will be destroyed, it says they will be put to useful purposes.

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The materials will be recycled.

Into what? (what exactly will they do with uranium and plutonium?)

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Have you ever been exposed to the concepts of poetry and prose? Which genre do you think the prophetic writings in Tanakh tend to be?

Yes. It depends on the content.

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It does not only depend on the content. It also depends on the form.

Word of the day: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=parallelism&btnG=Google+Search

You dont think swords into plowshares means convert weapons into something with a useful purpose?

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I think it is a poetic expression which doesn't require us to search for a civilian purpose for actual ammo.

Bear in mind that you've already allegorized it by assuming that it doesn't literally mean swords.

What do you think it means then?

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Look at what meforshim say.

They say its literal. Breaking the weapons and turning them into something useful.
ETA: not all of them.
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Breaking weapons or breaking spears and swords?

Nu, if there's no way to make a disarmed nuclear warhead itself literally useful then it's either a kashya on the Navi, or a kashya on the meforshim, or a kashya on you for extending it past swords to warheads. It isn't a kashya on the warheads.

Swords. But that brings us to the question of who kills with swords, and who plows with plows these days.

I'm sure theres a way. Thats why I'm asking the collective creative minds of h.com for solutions.

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Heres a quote (sorry I dont have a hebrew keyboard)
"yishbiru kli hamilchama, laasot mehem kli avodat adama ki lo yaasu od milchama'

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My solution is that there's no problem but the one you created for yourself.

You first decided that the prophecy isn't literal (ie, not only swords and spears) but then you decided that it is literal (ie, warheads into ?, instead of a more general message about the end of war).


You may find this useful:

http://www.mechon-mamre.org/searchgh.htm

I have more faith in the good people of h.com's imagination.
Did you read the source that I typed?


You want me to retype it in hebrew, or can you understand it without it?

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I don't want you to type anything in Hebrew. You said that you don't have a Hebrew keyboard, so I posted a link to a virtual hebrew keyboard which will allow you to type in Hebrew whenever or if ever you want ito. It was for informational purposes only.

Oh. Thanks.
So you saw that it means like I understood, that it means weapons into tools?

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Yes. Perhaps it does, or perhaps not. Whomever it is that you're quoting doesn't have an exclusive on the peshat.

If you want to say "according to the peshat that it means weapons, I want to know about nuclear warheads," then you've got two approaches. One, which was already offered to you, which is that weapons technology also has peaceful civilian uses. The second is that it doesn't mean nuclear warheads.

Or maybe it does. Maybe they'll use warheads for paperweights.

True. I only saw one pshat that it want literal.
How would the second one make sense?
Thank you. Thats all I was asking for. (although its supposed to be a kli for 'avodat adama' maybe you can squeeze paperweights into that category)
Anyone else have any guesses?

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I honestly think you created an unnecessary problem by not seeing this in its more poetic sense. Whichever pirush you were quoting from may have had to consider a peaceful use for a literal, physical cannon but he didn't have to find an agricultural use for a nuclear warhead itself. It could well be that the evolution of warfare shows us how to properly understand the pesukkim, given that we assume prophecy is true, and this is that is not meant to be taken quite as literally as the image of converting swords into plowshares conveys. We already agreed that this nevuah is in poetic and not prose form. While not all poetry is metaphorical, some surely is.

I was only able to find one pirush that said its not literal.(obviously I didnt do extensive research) I don't know what year these pirushim were written, but I'm sure theres uses for it. I may have ask my LAS. (local atomic scientist)
How?
Because plows and swords are obsolete?
True.


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I used to play on a jungle gym made out of recycled Russian ICBMs.

Another good idea. (a bit harder to squeeze into the 'avodat adama' category though, but good nontheless)


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It called Nuclear Power.

Haven't you ever watched the Simpsons?

You can use existing missiles for nuclear power?


Sure. Homers job? (Btw they don't even come close to family guy.)

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Yes. The uranium and plutonium from them. Power plants don't need them that refined but they certainly will work well.

The Simpson's is way better than family guy - it's just that dumber people find the cruder jokes funnier. Also FG rips off loads of the Simpson's jokes.

Cool. Good to know. It might be what the passuk is referring to. What about fighter planes?


I happen not to think the crude jokes are what makes it funny. The characters actually have much more depth in FG.


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The parts could probably be disassembled are readopted for commercial use.

More depth!? You've got to be kidding me! The show is a blatant ripoff!

What sort of commercial use?

Possibly. But they do it better.

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