Is the famous story of the Golem thought of as being literal or metaphorical? If the latter, what are the meanings behind the Golem in your opinion?

How about fictional?

If it is a fictional story do you believe there are metaphorical meanings behind it? If so, how do you interpret them?

No.

Do you have a blog about it?

Real and literal...

Fictional, with the caveat that as a legend it obviously appeals to a lot of people, and so there's something to be learned from examining why.

Do you mean Maharal's Golem or Golem in general? Shneyur Leiman argues forcefully that the maharal's Golem is fictional. However, the idea that one can make a golem is seems a given by the poskim. The Mishna Brura goes as far as to write that you can't count a golem for a minyan. The Chacham Tzvi has a tshuva on this too.

What would you say about the golems in the gmara?

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Forget the Gemara, I can introduce you to some...

Are they members?

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I haven't MET any members who are golems but I have my suspicions about some that I haven't met...

Not knowing gemara, I would assume they fit the seven qualifications in the mishna:

I'm referring to people created by amoraim.

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I'm ignorant. Sources?

The Vilna Goan reportedly wanted very much to create a golem... then he got bar mitzvahed and realized you don't just create them for fun.

Sanhedrin 65b.
"Rava created a man and sent him to R. Zera. The latter spoke to him but he did not answer. He asked, "are you one of the companions? Return to your dust" "

I guess Frankenstein is based on the golem idea?

I thought I went to his shul in Prague (it had a small museum in the upstairs ezras nushim), there was no attic there.....I was very disappointed.

I think it may not have really been the maharal's shul though.

Was it this one?



I heard now you can only get to this attack by this outdoor latter...

I don't remember what it looks like, it was a whole ago....

Thanks.
How do we know this is the same thing as a golem?

What melech said.

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Well assuming you know what we refer to when we use the word golem, then its just a matter of realizing that the gmara doesnt have to use the word golem to refer to a man-made person out of dirt who can't speak.

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Let me clarify your question please. You are asking how a man made man, made of dust, which can't talk but follows the will of it's creator is a the same thing as a man made golem, made of dust, which can't talk but follows the will of it's creator?

Yes but why the word golem, which is already specifically used in the mishna for the opposite of a wise man, a boor?

Ask yourself. "self, why did I use the word golem?" See what you answer.

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Why does 'everyone else' use the word "golem"?

My Rebbe would say, "See, this is why we don't teach girls gemara."

I like your rebbi.

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Yeah, he's pretty popular.

Thats the term for a mute without a brain.

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Now, the question. Who assigned the word "golem", which in mishna is used for "boor", to a mute manmade man of clay? edit: and why?

I would guess the same people who assigned any word in our vernacular. Us.

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see edit

See post 31.

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That's an outstanding question. To many, what was created by Rava and the popular current myths that have their source in later or foreign legends such as that of the homonculus, are not necessarily the same. The Torah True will undoubtedly claim that the poskim who rule on the inclusion of a golem in a minyan are speaking to physical reality and will use stories such as Rava's in sha's to support the view that golems are very real and possible, even if rare. Personally, I'm not so sure a golem in popular usage [ie post chazal, let's say from the 12th century CE onwards] is the same as what's spoken of in sha's by chazal.

What do you say it is that was spoken of in shas by chazal?

Quoted for posterity.

I blame Google spell check.

An idea. Perhaps to teach one of several didactic lessons, such as either that it's the power of speech that makes us human, or "If the righteous wished, they could create a world".
On the other hand, the golem of popular legend such as those spoken about in post 12th century CE Europe tended to be creations that develop dangerous natural powers that brings destruction.

Thank you, because the gemara doesn't call it a golem.

Just out of curiousity, why the Torah Truers?

The Torah Truers seem to have a need to believe that everything in sha's is literally true and there has been nothing new since chazal times, other than yeridat hadorot. If the poskim speak of golems, they must exist, and there must be precedent in shas, and any arrows they see in the tree of sha's, they immediately draw bullseye around them.

OK, thanks.

It should be noted that the Chacham Tzvi talks about a golem his grandfather made.

Do you believe that his grandfather made an actual golem and brought [temporary] ambulatory life [of sorts] to dirt through incantations and use of divine names?

Who are the Torah Truers? What happened to the OPS?

I have no idea, was probing to figure out how Melech differentiates.

I have no reason not to.

Do you think that the Chacham Tzvi believed he did?

Created from clay Golem serves as one of klei avodah for charash tzelem...Maybe it is necessary to take not only images and acts of 'Golem' but also words (in Hebrew) which are associated with them and to interpret that in accordance with wisdom of Kabbalah? Maybe 'Golem' is a reminder about ancient knowledge what was lost and forgotten? Just like that, the novel 'Der Golem' by Gustav Meyrink (this novel is penetrated with metaphors and kabbalistic hints from beginning to end) says that Golem symbolizes awakening of died persons through concealed life of spirit. Secret of esoterica?

By the way, what associations are suitable for the word/image 'charash'?

I have no reason not to.